Community Expectations

Posted May 09, 2010 • 16 Comments

Dribbble opened to the public last month while generating a lot of talk about community and exclusivity. Drawar runs a great community of its own where this week users discussed what disappointed them about Dribbble:

All those comments suggest the same things: the community doesn’t operate in a way they expect, its purpose isn’t well defined, and the ways its being used aren’t consistent.

Like I said at Drawar, I don’t think any of this matters:

My personal belief is that there are some apps and some communities that are open-ended by design. And there is no amount of strategizing that will help you determine if they succeed. The community must self-police and find its own purpose. And it might mutate over time. Like a restaurant, it will often fail. But when it succeeds, it won’t often be for the reasons the founders originally envisioned.

I’ve joined many communities over the years and one thing I’ve learned by talking to admins is no matter what void they’re trying to fill and what ideals a community is built around, they ultimately have to step back and surrender much of it to the community members themselves. A good community will develop a life of its own, beyond the control or desires of the admins. Predictions are futile.

I actually like that there’s no real endgame at Dribbble. The Design Swap concept is similarly loose. Once a tool is in the hands of a bunch of opinionated, overstimulated designers, it will be used in unexpected ways—that’s the only prediction that isn’t futile. Even if only 5 people find it fun and useful, a void has been filled.

Rather than searching for a purpose, I’ve been enjoying Dribbble for one of the reasons I (finally) came around to appreciating Twitter: because it’s a personality filter. It can indirectly reveal thoughts and personality traits. It can offer a composite of what’s happening in a person’s life.

Take my buddy Pat’s Dribbble profile. You can follow the initial sketches he made for something called Made by Athlete, to the increasing freelance projects, to an image he finally posted that said, “I resign”—

resign

As it turns out (drumroll) he was quitting his job to create a new freelance business called Made by Athlete. Through the same ambient intimacy that lets me get to know people through Twitter, I’ve gotten to see the changes happening in Pat’s life through a series of images.

Lately I’ve been studying old movie posters and title stills. When I make a new blog post, I’ll create a still and promote it at Dribble just for fun.

tweetstoreemember

If you remember, Twitter eventually outgrew their “What are you doing?” prompt because it didn’t reflect how people were using the app. I think Dribbble’s “What are you Working On?” already risks being outdated since, like the movie stills idea, the context of shots isn’t always about paid projects.

Another unexpected Dribbble behavior: people consistently vote hand-drawn illustrations to the top of the Popular view. Illustration skills are something a lot of web designers can envy. Many of these artists aren’t household names in the web design world either, which suggests they rely on talent over self-promotion. That those talents are celebrated seems like a sign of Dribbble’s success and pretty much the opposite of snobbery.

One of my favorite books is William Goldman’s (screenwriter of The Princess Bride, Butch Cassidy and the Sundance Kid) “Adventures in the Screen Trade”. What I love is there are no conclusions about filmmaking. Just one recurring anti-conclusion: “nobody knows anything.”

“The single most important fact, perhaps, of the entire movie industry is that ‘nobody knows anything’. Not one person in the entire motion picture field knows for a certainty what’s going to work. Every time out it’s a guess and, if you’re lucky, an educated one.”

Great formulas (ex: attractive cast, epic storyline) fail as often as they succeed. Goldman admits there are so many moving parts to assemble, it’s a miracle any movie gets made, much less a great one.

But then you will have fluke sleeper movies which are open-ended by design. They cost little to make and have no stars. Word gets out, they take on a life of their own, eventually they belong to an audience and the audience’s interpretation. They’re not trying too hard to fill a void which makes audiences connect for exactly that reason. No amount of control or contrivance can create that. Sometimes it’s just good chemistry and dumb luck.

  • http://www.rkunboxed.com Rona Kilmer

    I check out Dribbble regularly for nothing more than inspiration for my own work. It definitely delivers or shall I say the contributing designers deliver. Void filled.

  • http://hellocreative.com Matthew Spiel

    Darren, great post man!

    It seems like a lot of people have been spending some time deconstructing dribble. Glad to see your thoughts on it.

    I really think that it is all about how you use it. I am not big-shot designer by any means, so for me getting in to the community was a small miracle. I really struggled with just wanting to post my most polished work and establish a reputation as a strong designer. But then i realized it could be so much more helpful. both to me as a designer and the process i use.

    I live and work in a small town with no established design or arts movement/history so the biggest thing it has provided for me is a community/audience of incredibly talented designers, developers, dot comrades for me to bounce ideas off of. Prior to getting in I would not have had the opportunity to elicit feed back from fellow designers.

    Another thought I had is about how it has elevated/connected the design community. For the most part, the conversation in the design community is dominated by a few strong/popular voices (the upper class if you will). However, this does not truly reflect the amount of strong/quality designers in the industry. Dribbble has provided a very focused exposure for not just the cream of the crop, upper-class designers, but the handfulls of other middle-class designers who are cranking out beautiful work, but just never had the audience or opportunity to gain exposure.

    • Darren

      Another thought I had is about how it has elevated/connected the design community.

      Agree completely. Til now there haven’t been many other environments where your design ideas might pass in front of the eyes of the biggest designers in the industry. There are pros and cons to the idea of the content stream, but that is definitely one great benefit.

  • http://www.littleboxofideas.com Sneh

    I hear ya. It is not just a question of filling a void, but also one which asks “How long can you hold onto someone’s new found interest?”. Like with all things, people move on, after having oohed and aahed over something new and something exciting. Change is inevitable and people seem to need it even more, fed by their voracious appetites of discovering new things and acquiring more and more on the internet especially.

    I got very interested in Dribbble and would have liked to try it out. But apparently getting an invite is harder than seeing the Dalai Lama, so the interest faded. After all how long can you keep building up something and coveting something if you just can’t have it. I wish getting to Dribbble wasn’t “such” a novelty. I am a decent designer, by no means the best and I am sure there are many awesome designers out there who would love to be on board :)

    • http://www.jelleke.com Jelleke Vanooteghem

      And I hear you…

      I was really excited about Dribbble. And the interest is still there. But like you already mentioned, getting an invite can be really hard. And yet, if you know the right people or know how to ‘play it’, you don’t even have to be a fairly decent designer to get in.

      A couple of weeks ago, I made a little page called ‘My Wannabe Dribbble Shots’. But then I figured out I don’t want to resort to shameless smug self-promotion or begging ‘famous’ designers 1. in a series of annoying @ tweets 2. by spamming their inbox, just to be able to get an invite. I want to get in based on what I can do, not because of how I am able to sell myself.

      • Darren

        I want to get in based on what I can do, not because of how I am able to sell myself.

        A very fair point, which speaks to the original article which was about getting by on merits, rather than everything on the web being 100% level and democratic. No idea if this will succeed or alienate people from Dribbble in the long run, but I’m happy that not every community site has to live by the same philosophy.

  • http://www.tedgoas.com Ted Goas

    Hi Darren, interesting take on Dribbble. And I know what your talking about when you refer to websites pivoting and evolving based on demand and behavior. And if Dribbble or Design Swap make 5 people happy right now, technically it’s a success. I guess… technically…

    I didn’t realize Dribbble’s slogan is “What are you Working On?”… I see it as one more avenue to showcase work and (sometimes) get feedback. And this one looks like it’s more fun than useful.

    When does it officially become a success? That’s an interesting question.

    • Darren

      That might be a good question for another post, to ask Dan and Rich what they envision as Dribbble’s success. With so many things on the web (ex: Facebook), success means many many users, household name status, etc. With Dribbble, the philosophy definitely seems geared to quality over quantity.

  • http://www.amyhaywood.com Amy Haywood

    Dribbble’s success is also my frustration. Because it is by invite only, I know that the quality of work will undoubtably be good. However, it makes it harder for other users (like myself) to get an invite.

  • http://iamwibu.com WiBu

    I still stand by my claim that it “seems more like an exercise in marketing and branding than a useful tool for designers”.

    However, I agree that it is open ended and it will probably end up being whatever people use it for, whatever that may be.

    • Darren

      Curious do you mean marketing and branding for Dan and Rich, or for the members themselves? The point is to post what you’re working on. Obviously there’s a marketing element to it, but I don’t think anyone’s trying to obscure that.

  • http://www.davidkorona.com David Korona

    Hello Darren, glad to see more great discussion going on throughout the web. As the “filling the void” remark seems to be something a lot of folks have picked up on, I would like to talk about that for a bit. There was more to what I said than just those two questions quoted, in the Drawar forum post, that give a better sense of what I mean by filling the void but I’ll explain deeper here.

    When I ask what void was Dribbble filling in the community, I’m asking what is it’s purpose? What is it the developers are looking to achieve?

    When I visit the Dribbble, it seems it was built around the idea of sharing previews of what the members are working on, displaying them and, hopefully, getting some useful feedback. But, as you’ve shown here, there are members who are using Dribbble for other means. Some don’t care for feedback at all, some are using it for self promotion, some are using it to display UI Elements solely to receive feedback and some are using it just to show previews of upcoming work.

    So therefore, the reason why one member might like Dribbble may not be the same reasons another member might like Dribbble. By no means is it a bad thing that members are finding different ways to use Dribbble; but what happens if the developers feel some of the various uses are not what they want the website to be used for and moderate to reflect that? All the members who were using Dribbble for there own means then either fit into what the developers have in mind or leave.

    Although it’s an ‘if’, it’s not a very big if. Moderation is essential, especially on a community built via private invitation and members who are responsible for those they invite. Eventually, the changes I’ve written here will take place; there will even be members who will be given the boot. Should this not happen, Dribbble will become more of a mishmash of ideas and smaller ‘clique’.

    So what is might point exactly? A community requires clear purpose, a commonality, to grow. Without it there is no real community building, just a bunch of groups doing there own thing.

    This does not mean that Dribbble can’t adopt various ways the community is being used; but at this point, after so much discussion, Dribbble has yet to adopt or clarify anything.

    After reading through your post I understand where you’re coming from much better. You feel some communities are better built without a clear ‘why’, where the members take the ball and run (pardon the pun) with there own ideas. I feel there needs to be some clear guidelines to what’s meant to be happening on the website. There is definitely some middle ground between the two and I hope Dribbble will eventually get there. Even if only five people find it useful, it may be filling a void after all; but five people is a pretty small community.

  • Darren

    Thanks for following up David, great stuff.

    but what happens if the developers feel some of the various uses are not what they want the website to be used for and moderate to reflect that? All the members who were using Dribbble for there own means then either fit into what the developers have in mind or leave.

    That could certainly happen. I don’t read Digg, but I know there have been tensions between users and mods and they’ve had to amend features here and there to reflect it, meanwhile trying to prevent revolts. That mainly happens when the community is huge and lots of people are deviating. I know it’s too early to tell, but I don’t really see either of those things happening at Dribbble – either being huge or encouraging lots of micro-communities. If I had to guess, 90% of people will still stick by the site’s core purpose: “What are you working on?” But here and there, people might deviate, and it’s up to Dan and Rich to decide how heavy handed to moderate.

    A community requires clear purpose, a commonality, to grow. Without it there is no real community building, just a bunch of groups doing there own thing.

    I do think it has a clear purpose though, still: “What are you working on?”. So far I haven’t seen any groups, really, just individuals who pick up on ideas and run with them (rebounds etc), but they’re still in the minority. Even if cliques developed, that’s inevitable. It’s just a reflection of real life, for better or worse.

  • kamea

    Hi Darren,
    Where can I find Mimbo 2 (men for men magazine) download? http://www.darrenhoyt.com/demo/mimbo2/
    The link provided there leads to the current version (with soccer players). I don’t like this version.
    Thanks.

  • http://www.yuzulife.com silla

    it seems this discussion has died but even so i’d like to add that i’d like to see more women on sites like dribble. it’s like an old boys club, a virtual bohemian grove.

  • http://yuliantip06.student.ipb.ac.id yulianti

    it’s so interesting for discussion